mike – This is what happens when you let me edit the cover image for a group article
Opening Spiel – mike
You lucky lucky sods. (Tom – Roughly translates to we’re sorry this took so long)
Not only are you reading the definitive review on all the universal cards contained within the Direchasm core set but you are actually bearing witness to the rare Steel City triple threat. That’s right, myself, Tom Bond and his brother Oli Bond (Oli – I aspire to one day be my own man, but alas.) have all conspired to create this article, so you are not only getting the opinion from two of the best players to competitively play this game, you are also getting Tom’s opinion as well (Tom – This from Michael “Mollog is my crutch” Carlin). If you wish to know who has written the main text for a particular segment look for the name by the title and whenever you see bolded text within a section it will be preceded by a name tag as well, this lets us all right incredibly informed and relevant comments into each others sections.
By default we are reviewing everything for the Championship format as that is by far the most played format at this point in time. Any discussion of FAR lists and how they relate to our review is always going to be referencing the latest championship FAR list.
If you are interested in our reviews of the warbands in the core set then you can pop here for my Purifyer breakdown (Tom – an accurate description of Mike attempting to play the elves) and here for Tom’s Dread(ful) Pageant article.
We have dusted off the old scrolls to bring out the revered rating system for this review and realised that with the Nightvault rotation that it needs some updating. So the scroll has been suitably burnt and from its ashes we have some new guidelines for the different scores we give cards. As a reminder, our system is built to rate how ubiquitous a card should be, so a 5 should be in pretty much every deck that can take it, while a 1 shouldn’t be in any deck. This isn’t quite the same as rating the cards pure power as some cards are amazing for very specific niches of play, realistically the numbers are a guideline and you should pay more attention to what we write about the card. That said here is the brand spanking new Steel City review guidelines:
Rating System – also mike
5 – Best in class effects that should go in basically every deck that can take them (Hidden Purpose, Distraction)
4 – Powerful or versatile effects that are extremely strong in a particular archetype or pretty good in any deck (Great Strength, Gathered Momentum, Spectral Wings)
3 – Solid effects that will find a place in many decks (Great Fortitude, Supremacy, Sidestep)
2 – Limited effects that might be useful in some specialised decks (Abundance of Caution, Winded)
1 – Just plain bad cards (Fractured Memories, No One is Safe)
All right, that’s all the boring stuff out of the way, let’s dive into the cards themselves.
Objectives – T-Dog
This is a slightly more achievable but slightly less valuable version of annihilation. Like the aforementioned objective, this is very matchup dependant. In the matchup pictured on the card art Magore stands ready to take Stormdaddy down peg (which Lightning Dumbledore deserves). This is a good matchup for the card, as you only have to take down two opposing fighters for 3 glory! However, if you suddenly end up into more numerous opposition this looks more and more like a third end phase card. That is not necessarily a bad thing, it’s just the objective gets more and more likely to brick early on.
You also need to keep 2 fighters alive(mike – a tough task for the Dr). Bearing in mind you will be hurling your warriors at the enemy to try and cut them down, there is a good chance you lose a few of yours along the way. Aggro Hordes care less about surviving because they have so many models to charge with. Aggro hordes that resurrect models care super-less about surviving (super-less is a word) because they just come back and hit you again!
In some matchups this is scorable, in all matchups it is dicey. I would probably steer clear of this until at the very least we have some more accuracy gambits to help those early hits land.
This is a half decent end phase objective for taking out two enemy fighters. Again, this is pretty matchup dependent, but if you’re playing an aggressive deck you would hope to be able to take down two enemy fighters. I don’t put much stock in the alternative scoring condition for three reasons.
- It feels pretty inefficient to stack two separate attack actions on the same fighter (mike – the only deck that I can see scoring from this effect is one heavily using the combo mechanic)
- You have to include enough attack action upgrades to make it reliable to draw and equip two
- The most popular attack action upgrades are Amberbone weapons, which you discard after taking a fighter out of action with them, making it even harder to stack two of these upgrades on the same fighter.
So forget the alternative scoring condition, but remember this is a Hybrid objective. If you find yourself including a few (Show of Force, Gathered Momentum, Unexpected Pitfall, Awesome Predator…the list really does go on now) then consider Adaptive Strategy.
This is a very good end phase card for factions with easy access to 3+ damage attacks. One upgrade will get you to the required 4+ damage to score the card. Equally warbands with access to high damage fighters are more likely to be able to one shot their opponents, thereby earning themselves the primacy token. Morgoks Krushas, Grashracks Despoilers, Hrothgorns Mantrappers and even The Grymwatch (mike – pretty sure Tom didn’t list Mollog here just to trigger me)have 3 damage fighters off the bat. The Wurmspat and Blade Coven can inspire to get to 3 damage as well. This is a very versatile Hybrid card and a good way of bringing the primacy rules into the game.
Hold more objectives than your opponent. Into an aggressive warband you’re job will just be to try to keep one fighter on an objective whilst spiky death missiles fly at that fighter trying to knock it off. Against objective warbands you will enter into the war of the pushes, as both of you try to efficiently cover your objectives whilst disrupting your opponents’ game. I like this card and the effect it has on the way you play.
Even if you don’t run this card, be mindful that your opponent might, and act accordingly.
NOTE: In my Dread Pageant article I cover what effect rotation has had on objective play when discussing the Hedonites in faction copy of this card, check it our here and look for the heading “Diversion!”.
Mike and Oli will cover the Gambits and Upgrades that give you Hunger. Currently getting to two Hunger on a fighter seems achievable if you index heavily into the Hunger cards. Unfortunately there is only 1 glory to be scored for doing so. Whilst some of the Hunger Gambits and Upgrades do benefit from the counters, I’m not sure there is enough Hunger in the game yet to make a deck out of it.
As soon as a critical mass of Hunger cards is hit this card feels like it will be a staple.
Rating 1 (subject to change when more cards come out)
Another Hybrid card which has two very scorable conditions. If you take this card you will probably have one way you want to score it though. Wurmspat and Rippa’s might try to run across the board and hope everyone is alive by the time this card is drawn. Hrothgorn and Mollog will simply exist and be intimidating enough to score this from the off. A decent Hybrid which is excellent for some warbands.
(Oli – Its worth noting there are quite a lot of ways of piling additional wounds onto fighters right now, meaning that this can be a consideration even on factions that cap out at 5 wounds, like Krushas and Profiteers)
A slightly worse reprint of Strange Demise and Sorcerous Scouring. This card rewards you for taking an enemy out of action with a Spell ATTACK action. Your gambit spells wont trigger this. Given Gloryseeker and Fighter’s Ferocity have now rotated out there exist only a handful of faction specific cards that will allow you to boost your spell damage above 2. With likely only one spell attack action in your warband, requiring it to finish off an opponent seems a little risky. Even if you are able to get the kill, you could easily miss a charge and then the card bricks for the rest of your turn. If your spell-slinger dies this card is off the table too. I’ll give this a miss for now because if the diceyness of the card, but it could find a home in some magic heavy decks.
You know, those magic decks we’re seeing everywhere at the minute…
I’m just getting an update, Nightvault left and took the magic with it. Gutted.
(Oli – Rip killy magic decks)
Mollog Smash! Hrothgorn Gobbles! Vasillac impales sensually!
Gurzag is also there.
(mike – Don’t forget Thredda you heathen)
If you like to mix it up with your leader then this card is a staple. I expect this surge to make its way into most aggro decks. This objective isn’t a gimme as it relies on a specific model dealing the killing blow to an enemy when this card is in your hand. Having said that it is an objective that rewards what is already part of your game plan.
Are you Hrothgorn? Have you already taken Savage Exemplar and The Beast is Slain? Are you determined to only score surges for wiping out enemy models?
I respect your balls good sir. This card is for you.
For everyone else it’s probably worth passing over. Unless you’re a mad lad running Hunting Season in which case how do you physically carry those medicine balls around all day??
Surge of Aggression
A surge Hybrid which is almost identical to Awesome Predator. If you are entertaining playing aggressive this card is a good way to ensure primacy is in the game. Primacy actually isn’t that tricky to grab if you are including Great Strength and Savage Strength in your deck (you could even throw in Sting of the Ur Grub for good measure).
This card alongside cards like Savage Exemplar may start to bring back the good old aggro days of each kill being accompanied by a juicy surge to reward your dice rolling fanaticism. Expect to see this a lot now, and even more as more primacy cards that benefit from just having the token like Fearsome Trappings appear in the pool.
A slightly kinder version of Making a Statement from the shadespire days, this three glory end phase cards wants you to aggressively hold objectives (who knew that was a thing?). This card might see play in hordes like Grymwatch, tricky speedy warbands like Skaven, or aggro objective flex decks – potentially even The Dread Pageant.
I’ve not seen a lot of this card yet, but if feels a decent payout for something that is achievable. The tricky part isn’t necessarily getting onto the objectives. It’s getting your opponent off (the objectives) and then remaining on them yourself.
Rating 2 – but might be worth experimenting with
Do you run fast and shoot far? Your name is Skaeth? Have a surge on the house!
Fast moving aggro warbands love this card. It combos well with Cover Ground and Gathered Momentum to provide access to glory without having to deal a killing blow. The alternative score condition of killing with a range 3+ attack opens the door for warbands like Thundricks and Farstriders to have a pop at this one too. If you have fast models with ranged attacks then you are living the dream.
Of course, if you don’t pack cards like Spectral Wings, Malkyn Grace, Savage Speed and Tracking you will struggle to rack up the movement required for this card. The tax this card can place on your deck is why it only scores a 3 rather than a 4. If you want to run speedy cards anyway then this is definitely worth taking.
Gambits – Oli
While the effect of Dauntless aspect is alright, this card is directly comparable to some faction cards such as Heroic Guard, which by virtue of not being a spell, or having range is just straight up better. Heroic Guard doesnt see play because frankly there are much better gambits in the game, so why should this?
Well there is a good answer to that. As of current there is a fun little Purifiers deck that run alot of surges for having your fighters on guard. The appropriately dubbed Guard Purifiers list therefore have an affinity for all things Guard related, as it will translate into easy glory. We are yet to see if this archetype is actually very competitive, however its certainly a fun build that has potential.
(Tom – this is also a spell, and so works with any objective that wants you to cast spells. Being a single channel this card may eventually be worth taking simply for the purpose of being cast)
Rating 5 – Mollog is being wacked on the card art. Best card in the set.
In seriousness I’m undecided on this card. Plus 1 damage ploys for the next attack have existed before in the game, especially in season 1, but have never really seen play. There are several good reasons for this; firstly if you miss the attack the ploy is wasted and losing a card like that is a big deal. Second it telegraphs your attack is coming now, green lighting the use of Great Fortitude, Duardin Resilience or what other nasty they may be holding, again potentially wasting the card. Having said that however the cleave is a nice accuracy boost if you have hunger. I think at the moment this is a bad choice, but one to keep an eye on if more hunger support is released in coming sets.
(Tom – This card was run against me by a Grymwatch player (HI ZACK) in the most recent online tournament. Having a gambit give you extra damage sets you ahead of the usually even curve of damage versus wound upgrades. Suddenly you can alpha strike big targets turn 1! This works best if you can combo it with dice cards as well, and as Oli said is has the drawback of being telegraphed, however just based on Slakeslash’s longevity in those games I’d give it some consideration if you’re aggro)
This card is so very close. Spectral Wings is a staple, Tracking is excellent, Malkyn Grace is very powerful also. Movement is one of the most powerful stats in the game, across all archetypes. Aggro use it to close in for kills, Objective use it to grabs far reaching tokens, and control use it to kite around the arena finding safe spots slower fighters cant reach. On top of this powerful surges like Cover Ground, Gathered Momentum and Winged Death really incentivise the use of these ploys to give the boost you need to score reliable additional seed glory. Two move is generally the sweet spot as it allows a lot of fighters to hit 6 move, however plus 1 on its own is not really good enough. If hunger support grows this may become a very important card.
Rating 2 (could go to 3, with extra support)
This is where Mikes carefully thought out scoring system goes to pot. Like hell this is going to be rated with a 2. This card is essentially for every wound a chosen fighter has, on a 50/50 heal 1 wound token. In your average warband its O.K but nothing special, as you generally either get killed in the first hit, or wont heal enough to survive a second. However when you use this on bulkier characters, say Mollog or Hrothgorn (especially if massive bulk is equipped), this card can easily (and regularly does believe me) heal 3/4 wound tokens.
This translate to more that just a wasted attack. The card is essentially a reactive equip of 3 great fortitudes for zero cost. This comparison doesn’t translate exactly in all fairness, but its a good approximation, and if you get hunger added its even more effective. The next card, Hungry Advance, is a good start and I’m sure future sets will bring more.
The question going around for this card is whether it deserves a spot on the FAR list in the future. I think this is a real shame as I think the card itself is a nice idea, however due to some horrible balancing when it comes to fighters that have 6 wounds or more I think its honestly inevitable. I’m really saddened by this as the concept is fine. Talking to high level players people tend to agree that with some kind of restriction against higher wound fighters this card would actually be much more well received.
This card is potentially a game changing auto include for some factions, while a complete waste of time for others, which puts it somewhere between a rating of 1 and 5 (helpful I know). So when in doubt use maths!
(Tom -Welcome to Warhammer Underworlds: Mollog, where the dice are made up and the wounds don’t matter)
(mike – I recently used this to save a Spiteshroom from death by Channel the Wind, blocking an opponents Unexpected Pitfall, he was not happy)
This is a basic push card. Unfortunately you have to go towards the nearest enemy, but with some easy set up this can be very easy to play around. It alright for objective decks, but needs a good set up. Better for aggro, where the direct restriction means a little less. This card is very good for Mollog and Hrothgorn, who really utilise the push well, and can also combo it with Ferocious Resistance. This is a decent card, that will only get better as more sets are released.
Makes random people near you hungry. Also hurts the bad people. This card can be compared to cards like chain lightning and unfocussed blast. This can be a really powerful spell, dealing multiple damage while also giving yourself hunger (alternately it can be used just to try and generate multiple hunger counters) is a big deal, playing towards what is likely to be two of your victory conditions. With more hunger synergy to be released throughout the season it seem like it could be a legit choice.
Then you realise that the card is
Channel... Focus? a Swirly! This means that it going off is a 50/50 ( Tom – only if your a shit wizard) which is quite the risk especially if you are relying on the card going off for damage. Additionally this card is a scatter effect, meaning that its not even guaranteed to hit the target. All of a sudden this card looks like a massive liability. I like the effect, but there is far to much risk for this to be legitimately competitive.
So this is a card.
I really don’t know where to begin with this card, as it has so much that it can do. The championship format now has an incredible amount of cards which synergise well with hunters and quarries, and this card allows you to essentially cheat them for a round. Now I’m not saying to take your vanilla Reavers deck and use this to run Ahead of the Hunt, Brought to Bay and The Beast is Slain, but with something like The Dread Pageant…
When you have a faction that already has hunters (and especially with Dread pageant having the only natural Quarry in the game), this card allows you to double down on strong synergistic cards like Hunters Talisman, but more important allows you to try out some of the riskier ones like Hunter Hunted. On the note of Hunters Talisman this card also allows you to equip hunter restricted cards to non hunter cards for the round and then still befit from the effects in rounds after. So if you want more dice and cleave on Mollog, pair Hunting season with Hunters Talisman and Predators Lockbox and laugh yourself to the bank.
There is so much you can do with this, but then again its very risky. This card allows you temporary access to resources you normally wouldn’t, this means however if the cards don’t hit your hand at the same time Hunting Season is just going to burn a hole in your hand. Im really looking forward to trying this more, so my rating for now might be well off.
Short range distraction on a spell. Noice. Its definitely not an auto include but there is still a place for this card. Spell decks are going to eat this up. Its an easy to cast spell that has a reasonable good effect, which really can be a dream come true for some Stormsires builds, and perhaps for Eyes of the Nine when some crazy idiot (looking at you Mike) tries to make that work for the 15th time. Again not a great card, but some decks are going to want to at least try it.
Not sure who hates this more, aggro or objective players. Objective players trying to get that second objective for literally any of there glory. Nope. They just sort of fell off it, maybe into a lethal hex, why not? Mollog running across the map for his only charge, to pull of a key 4 glory kill. Nope he slipped over backwards, and is now out of range and crying to himself in his sleep. This is not a joke, Mike no longer runs Bold Conquest because of Slickrock. Honestly its just a generally all round good card for any deck. One that should always be considered.
(mike – this card needs forsaking, yes I am salty)
Thrill of the Hunt
All round pretty reasonable card if you are playing an aggro primacy deck (and if your not placing primacy in your aggro deck, I’m genuinely shocked/impressed). This allows you to gain the primacy token even if you don’t one shot your enemy. This is a very useful ability to have in a world where large wound count fighters are having a fun time, and the new warbands have generally high defence characteristics making ping damage very valuable.
The value of this card doesn’t end at granting the primacy token however, this kill grants the ability to either heal a fighter one or push your fighter one. Both of which when used at the proper time can be extremely powerful effects. As mentioned a lot so far high wound fighters are very common right now, and healing one can often tip the kill threshold, leading to another attack being required to take the kill. Another very common characteristic right now is powerful range 2 attack actions. Being able to push after attack can be very useful here to bring more fighters into attack range and allow a strong fighter to continue making attack actions.
The only downside of this card is that it is a good ploy in a very contested pool of ploys. You definitely want to run this card, but I feel it is going to find its way onto the cutting floor all to often.
Upgrades – mike
Doesn’t even give himself a capital….
This is a super niche option for a deck that is focused entirely around casting as many spells as possible. With most of the objectives that reward you for doing that rotating with Nightvault alongside some of the most powerful spells I don’t think that there is a way to make this work right now. Even if it did work you could just take a +1 wound card instead and it would be more reliable.
Here is something exciting, an upgrade that makes you a hunter and actually has another useful effect. Re-rolling an attack dice is a fantastic accuracy upgrade that range 2 and above fighters can leverage into a lot of successful attacks and kills. It’s tricky to say at this point just how likely you are to get the primacy token early enough in a round for this to be relevant, at this point in Direchasm my general experience is that you have one attack per round that grabs you the token, this is heavily warband dependent though. Fighter’s like Mollog can keep making attack after attack that hit’s hard enough to grant primacy and they have a lot of reasons to be a Hunter these days, cough Trophy Belt.
Right now, I don’t think many people take this, it’s a powerful option for those that can though. Keep an eye on this one if getting Primacy becomes easier as we get more Direchasm universal cards.
I can see why we havn’t (yet) got a reprint of Spectral Armour/Acrobatic this season, just looking at the Dread Pageant and Myari’s Purifiers defence stats makes me think that the play-testers nipped that one in the bud pretty quickly. Formidable Defence is a very conservative option that only the hardest control builds will really want to take. Losing a dice on the attack is just such a loss that it makes whatever fighter you put it on mostly useless for any future attacks. Slaanesh players might be tempted to put this on Glisette, it certainly makes hitting her harder, personally I’d avoid that route and go for Voltroning up your leader instead.
This card is almost impossible to rate right now because hunger doesn’t really do much. Primacy is a mechanic that has a bunch of inbuilt benefits while, so far, hunger appears to be more like Hunter/Quarry in that it’s a trigger for other cards to work with. Even if/when hunger becomes more relevant, effects that only grant you an effect at the beginning of the round are generally pretty weak, play this in round 1 and you get a maximum of 2 counters while if you draw it in round 3 its totally dead. No thanks.
Master of Spoils
Unlike the hunger mechanic, primacy starts the season with a very powerful effect, potentially gaining you 3 glory over the course of the game. Master of Spoils basically lets a more ping damage focused deck take part in the mechanic, for a small deckbuilding cost. I like the design here, especially the counter-play it gives to your opponent when this fighter dies. For this to become ‘good’ we need more ping damage cards and probably a few more reasons to care about primacy, right now it’s just about take able for something like Farstriders.
The developers are obviously still thoroughly enjoying this game. Just look at this delightful mess of a card. It’s a massive fuck you to anyone trying to attack your fighter which then has the tricky effect of transferring to your opponent and making them an uninviting target to attack. Realistically the only decks that want to take this are super defensive ones that have never attacking as part of their core game plan. Right now I don’t think Direchasm’s card pool quite supports that playstyle but with a few more cards like this we might see it become a nice niche for those who prefer to play a more gentlemanly game of underworlds.
(Tom – it’s worth noting that the attack actually has to hit the fighter with this card equipped in order to transfer the upgrade, as the reaction is after the deal damage step. Punishment for trying to hit Glissette in the first place)
The first of two absolutely insanely powerful savage upgrades. Over three seasons of Warhammer Underworld it seems the developers have realised that a simple +1 movement on an upgrade like Great Speed is not powerful enough to be attractive to competitive players. We have seen previous experiements looking to improve on the Great Speed formula in the form of Victor’s Speed, a carbon copy of Great Speed with the added ability of being played for free after a kill. Apparently even that wasn’t enough and now we have a delectable +2 movement speed on a universal upgrade.
Two movement is a breakpoint that makes both Cover Ground and Winged Death a lot more reliable for warbands that want to take them, it basically sits alongside gambits like Spectral Wings, Malkyn Grace and Tracking which all also grant 2 extra move, letting you really build a reliable deck around the effect. Outside of triggering some solid surges that extra speed gives you some fantastic control over both boards, no one can really hide from you and conversely you can sit outside of their attack range before choosing when to strike.
As an added bonus this also makes you a Hunter. Being a Hunter is basically a tag that lets you take gambits and upgrades that you wouldn’t normally be able to, Snare, Tracking, Hunter’s Talisman and Trophy Belt being some of the prime examples while also allowing you to score a few more objectives that care about being a Hunter. At the moment magic has been super diminished with Nightvaults rotation and I’m going to make a bold claim, with the current card pool being a Hunter is better then being a level 2 wizard. So to see this as an added bonus on an upgrade which is already very powerful is absolutely bonkers.
There is a downside here, for most warbands its just a technicality that won’t ever come up but for some, losing an extra defence dice is a big deal. Purifiers are probably hit the hardest here, alongside Stormcast warbands that are looking to inspire. For anyone that is reliable getting to two defence you might want to skip this upgrade, those defence dice are super valuable after all. It’s worth noting that Substance Siphon is not affected by the negative part of this card, as it cannot be modified, Mollog players rejoice.
As a pure bundle of stats Savage Speed is easily a 3 card, the benefit of granting the Hunter keyword takes it to a 4 and that downside is no where near enough to drop it back down again. Welcome to the speed meta
(Oli – Honestly I think this closes in at a 5 rating. Plus two speed is huge deal, especially with Cover Ground, Gathered Momentum and Winged Death being some of the best surges right now. Being a hunter is a huge buff, and minus 1 defence to a minimum of 1 is not actually a cost to 70% of fighters. As Mike mentions above it also really synergises with Substance Siphon. One of the best cards around right now that any deck should try to make room for)
Great Strength is a fantastic card. In Warhammer Underworlds you always want to be killing an opponents fighter in a single attack, its much more action efficient, makes charges a lot less dangerous and now gives primacy more often. Savage Strength is carbon copy of this fantastic universal card that, like Savage Speed, also gives the keyword Hunter. Warbands that are hit hard by the downside of losing a defence dice are really going to be missing out by not having good access to these cards as they are going to be staples for a long time to come.
I also just want to mention that I love how the Hunter keyword is being treated in Direchasm as opposed to Beastgrave, with powerful upgrades like this the older warbands that don’t have Hunters by default now also have access to some of the more sexy cards from recent sets.
(Tom – Its so nice that Hunter is getting more accessible. Warbands with one or two hunters can now take hunter cards and these upgrades. Warbands like the Blade Coven, Despoilers and The Dread Pageant are having a whale of a time)
Talking about upgrades that grant the Hunter keyword, it looks like the big cycle of attack upgrades for this season do the same job, this time helping the horde warbands a bit more. A range 4 attack on 2 smash is also a solid statline, when you combine this with the re-roll vs targets with a Move/Charge token you are getting a fantastic package in one upgrade. This is also surprisingly good on small elite warbands, like the Stormcast, to give them an attack action each round before going off on 3 charges, its even better for Morgok’s Krushas as it also gives them a Waaagh! counter every time they attack.
If we see more ranged attack support cards later in the season, stuff like Gloryseeker then this goes up in value even more. Right now I can only assess it by the current card pool and its not quite amazing. We currently have a meta where most people are voltroning up one big fighter that then goes on a killing spree or going all in on controlling objective tokens in order to outscore their opponent. This dosn’t massively help with either of those game plans.
In general I rate this slightly lower then the bow, its a similar package where you trade one damage for 2 range. I am splitting hairs here and this card is definitely close enough for the same rating.
Words that go at the end – mike
Phew, we are now up to date with all the releases. I’m not sure exactly when we will get another article out, I could possibly do one on my Mollog deck that recently came 3rd in a 50+ player tournament. The next big content drop from us will probably be the long awaited 3rd episode of Chatting Crit, in which I have to argue with Tom that big bois are bad for the game, god that hurt.